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Would it be possible to have Miqo to check every retainer’s listed items to automatically be the lowest price within a set price range?
For example if I am selling 10 stacks of Potion for 1k each, Miqo will check on MB if you are the lowest price, if not, then it will lower price by a set amount (so now it will lower to 998/999 gil each, but no lower than say 900)
We consider this feature, but we are not sure whether it will be really useful. The problem is quite easy to explain, and it’s not even about market domination (which is also a factor but not the main one).
Let’s take a simple example.
- You instruct the undercutting bot with a minimum of 900 gil per potion.
- Somebody else instructs the undercutting bot with a minimum of 800 gil per potion.
- Both of you start from 1,000 gil but just within a few minutes your bot stops at 900 while the other one keeps going.
Your potions are not selling anymore. - Now you have to look at Market Board manually and evaluate the situation.
You decide to reset the minimum to 700 gil. - The cycle repeats.
So the question is: How exactly is this any different from undercutting without a bot?
Instead of using the Market Board you now use a tool, but since it’s public you have to assume that everybody uses the same tool.We would like to hear more feedback from our users.
How would you solve this dilemma?As nice as a feature as it would be to add it would probably end up being more detrimental than beneficial. Chances are you will be competing with another tool on a listed item or two and end up just lowering it constantly pulling it on and off the market affecting everything else you are selling. Would have to be a hardcoded minimum time limit to attain lowest market price of say 10 minutes, and we’d still end up with crashed markets because of those setting low minimums and miqo just lowering it all night vs another unless again a hardcoded limit of 1gil price drops.
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This reply was modified 7 years, 1 month ago by
f43ak.
I agree with the posts so far, setting up an automatic ‘MB Scanner’ and undercutting over a period of time would be impractical as soon as two people are doing the same thing. However, a process similar to the ‘Desynthesis’ function could be a solution to the constant relisting of high volume, low stack sales of things like consumables and high-end intermediate materials. A subroutine such as this would be aimed at running every time you were back in a city, or could be worked into existing scenarios to be run when you finish collectables for the hour, etc.
Perhaps a menu to which users can add items, including fields for stack size, preferred price, lowest price. Miqobot could check each retainer, iterate through the list and change prices for any items it finds that retainer selling, before moving on to the next retainer.
I personally prefer to stick to high value, low volume items because I can’t be bothered updating prices all the time, but I can see how such a function would be desirable to those who sell consumables.
I find that this would be more useful in consumable mats that are in constant demand, if you are at the market’s lowest price and it’s still not being sold (despite say, undercutting by 1-5 gil every 5 minutes for a whole day) then that tool would not be useful in the first place
Most of my crafts are raid food and potions, they tend to sell out rather quickly, while I do agree even just one other user would immediate trigger a price war, you’d have to stop using miqo’s other functions and stand by a summoning bell
I had not considered the pov that this does more harm than good when “everyone” is using it, I suppose it is probably safer to not implement something than to retract it afterwards from a backlash
Yeah, for it to be useful it would have to be able to be put in a scenario and if it can then it can be misused and end up being quite annoying for everyone, lol. If you’re looking for feature additions I would personally love a market scanner that collects a dataset constantly of every or select items and keeps a record/graph. If it were to pass a certain set threshold it could notify you of potential markets quickly or just show you a general flow of when to market your stuff on your server for optimal sales. Just a thought.
…If you’re looking for feature additions I would personally love a market scanner that collects a dataset constantly of every or select items and keeps a record/graph. If it were to pass a certain set threshold it could notify you of potential markets quickly or just show you a general flow of when to market your stuff on your server for optimal sales. Just a thought.
I really like the idea. Maybe keep the data on local & personnal. And since it would just be one new funtionnality of Miqo you wouldn’t have to run a complex service like ffxiah, back in the time… as it’s just the character that would camp the MB and store the data from some wishlist. This could boost Miqo’s usage as potential markets are being discovered by the functionnality.
The idea of automatically undercut would just end up ruining the market, it’s already so weak on some items and because of idiots undercutting by 20/30% or just putting themselves 1st even though there’s a 50k gap between a 99 stack that is 1st on sale and a single that is second…
I really like the idea of using Miqo to extract pricing information off the market board. I have several spreadsheets that I use for my own personal crafting to determine gross profit margins and right now the only way I can get this information is to look up each component and sub-component to check the price. A feature that would allow me to export data from the game client into a file would be incredibly awesome.
The game takes forever to display results from MB database queries because they don’t allow spam there, and I imagine SE could spot you very easily by checking unconventional amounts of queries like this.
Not that it is forbidden, but super suspicious enough to draw unnecessary attention on you. Just like botting stupidly Gold Saucer Out of a Limb non stop.My point is, it’s already so easy to make millions of gils each week with Miqobot, this feature would be relevant if Miqobot didn’t had already so many ways to make gils.
But right now, if some players really struggle to make gils, up to the point they need that, I think they’re doing it wrong.The game takes forever to display results from MB database queries because they don’t allow spam there, and I imagine SE could spot you very easily by checking unconventional amounts of queries like this.
Not that it is forbidden, but super suspicious enough to draw unnecessary attention on you. Just like botting stupidly Gold Saucer Out of a Limb non stop.My point is, it’s already so easy to make millions of gils each week with Miqobot, this feature would be relevant if Miqobot didn’t had already so many ways to make gils.
But right now, if some players really struggle to make gils, up to the point they need that, I think they’re doing it wrong.I partially agree because i’m making so many millions with just a geared gatherer and a small scenario after 4.1 update it’s almost insane… But i think we have to keep in mind that we all bot to save time, some features will always drag attention on ourselves depending on how they’re being used. Being able to quickly watch markets’ evolution would save a shit ton of time and probably has the potential to slowly equilibrate a server’s economy. We just need to read Miqo’s latests posts in SB stage 2 to understand how important is to send an array of gathered stats to an action (or item, in our case).
Also, if such a feature had to come by some day, might be a good idea to set a frame-time-random (ex.: between 30-40min) so that it has no regularity beside the user’s wishlist.
Information and analytics are never useless. Let’s say you set your scenario to go do your usual gathering routes, and in your scenario you put a clause to go update your market prices in it while waiting for a node which could be your wishlist, if it passes a set value it can notify you that a market that you usually try to make money on is at an optimal place for you to take advantage of when you come back to the game or what have you. Hell it could even act as a trigger and pause gathering, craft the items then resume once complete. When you come back you have items ready to list that are at a lucrative market value.
I still believe it’s lot of work, for little gain.
If you’re already inside a specific market, you don’t really need to know when it’s going to be profitable, have your items in the market at the price you want to sell them, when it’s going to be profitable, your items will sell, because they’re already there, at the price you wanted.You want to sell some HQ ingot/lumber/whatever for 20k a pop, one by one, have 3 of them in the MB, you don’t need to know when it’s going to be profitable, they will sell the moment it’s profitable, when every other offers won’t be as good as yours, and it always happens, unless you really picked a silly price.
It’s like for materia, you want to sell them for 100k a pop, but people are selling theirs 50k a pop, you want to know when you can sell yours at 100k? You don’t need to. Put yours at 100k, wait for someone to clear the MB by blowing all the materias there in failed attempts of pentameld, and soon enough your materias will be the next ones to sell, and since you were already there, you lost no time.
For a tool like this to be really useful, you would need to use it the other way around. You would have to tell it to buy specific items for you when they’re below a certain price.
Anything you want to buy cheap to sell high, or use to make valuable stuff with high margins.Making a tool like this to auto-undercut is useless and counter-productive (Prisoner’s dilemma), making it to get an alert/reports on what to sell and when has very little value while really being complicated to build, as well as difficult to interpret the datas and react quickly enough.
But making a tool like this to monitor specific items in order to buy them once they reach a certain price is useful, it’s how you make billions, it’s easier to implement, it doesn’t really spam too much the MB if set correctly, it still works in your way even if different Miqobot users are on the same items, because unlike the auto-undercut, it keeps prices high.
It’s a long term approach, you have to be smart and know the game, buying for cheap items quite useless now, that you know will be on high demand the next patch.Yup, recently bought dozens of glazenuts for 40k each just before 4.11, only because i though it to be a good investment, sold them back a few days ago for 6 times the price.
Materias are a real seperate market because of their special use and RNG. A single unlucky & fortunate character could empty the control materias VI’s on MB in a minute (i know because i did). If it wasn’t possible to overmeld VI’s on the 3rd slot, materias’ market would be linear, more or less at least on high-end ones.
Of course you can put your items for sale at the price that you think is the more profitable to sell them for, but even though i have 8 retainers, i would need 3x times more of them to put all of my stuff for sale while still saving room for what my retainers bring me, what i craft, gather, garden, and so on…
Let the user think what’s profitable from what he ordered Miqo to look at, and maybe save one retainer and his 20 selling slots for that.
So, yeah, of course it could be used to buy instead of sell, it’s the point of statistics’ neutrality.
this is kinda pointless… especially if you run into someone like me where I could go below my cost just to dominate the market and my cost is pretty much 0 gil since I gather everything myself (well…via Miqobot as most other users do here.)
and if you drop your price low enough (let’s say 1 gil)… I will simply buy up all your listings and raise my price back up to where I wanted it to be.
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